They are documenting every wrong thing she has done when she actually has been in, to try and build a case to get rid of her, but it’s very difficult in the NHS unfortunately. Even being suspected of killing multiple babies wasn’t enough!
They are documenting every wrong thing she has done when she actually has been in, to try and build a case to get rid of her, but it’s very difficult in the NHS unfortunately. Even being suspected of killing multiple babies wasn’t enough!
Wait, she’s only worked 9 shifts and is suspected of killing babies?
Perhaps her not coming in for shifts is…a good thing?
Perhaps shes not sick, well, if she’s suspected of that then she is - I digress, but maybe she’s in jail?
It sounds like she may be gaming a system that has possibly gamed her. It’s unfortunate to the other staff who are the ones impacted but from what I’ve heard about nurses being overworked/underpaid I’m surprised there aren’t more that are massively taking the piss like you’d suspect in the above case.
Building a case just because someone has called in sick is also a dangerous game, you can’t really hold someone being sick against them if they have the right certs. If she caught wind of that there’d probably be a bigger problem for the hospital than a perpetual sick leave menace.
It was a reference to the Lucy Letby case, multiple doctors and other staff reported her and were made to apologise to her instead of them properly investigating her.
They can’t do anything about the sickness in getting rid of her, they are just trying to build a case of every other little thing she does wrong. For instance her ID card wasn’t working (needed to open doors etc), there is a spare on the ward, but only the ward manager can sign it out. Instead of asking my partner, she signed it out in my partners name. Not enough in itself to get her fired, but if they can find multiple cases similar to that, they can at least try.
I can appreciate what you’re saying, but in any work place, that many instances of sickness would be massively suspect. While she may 100% be in the clear on that end, it would be common practice to start reviewing other parts of her work that may point to further issues.
As an example, my part of the business regularly reviews paper work sent in by other parts, we report back to the other team leaders when we have issues with paperwork not being correct on a continuous basis. Red flags like that can allow managers to see if there’s any other issues that need to be addressed. We recently had a huge conversation about one of the Melbourne team for incorrect paper work, turns out she’d also requested a whole load of extra work that she didn’t need. Would have cost the company $20k if we hadn’t raised it.
That’s what I mean though, they are effectively treating her unfairly by finding things to fire her for because of her sick leave. I would assume no other regular employee is scrutinised to that degree. If I found out my employer was doing that because I’ve been legitimately sick I’d make it a huge, huge problem for them to be honest.
I’m not a workplace lawyer but it doesn’t seem fair to effectively try your hardest to build a case to fire someone because they’ve been legitimately sick (legitimacy being proven by you’d assume valid certificates - it’s sort of obvious they’re taking the piss but with GP certificates you’re basically completely covered). Assuming there might be emails or other evidence to tie together the reason for trying to get rid of her being her sick leave which may make things worse.
Happy to be corrected but there’s probably grey area there, just something to be careful of. However if they do find something big that’s an instant strike and against policy that’d be a good reason, but if there are concerted efforts to find a bunch of little things and use that as a reason I’d guess that’d be seen as as unfair treatment.
Yeah it’s a tough situation for them to deal with. All the staff think she’s taking the piss and are having to pick up the extra work, which in turn is making them all burnt out. Fine balancing act trying to keep everyone else happy and not doing anything which could be potentially illegal.
Just by coincidence, she is on a training course with this persons old manager, he had exactly the same issues with her. In 2 years she took 72 days of ‘carers’ leave to apparently help care for a family member. He said she was never off with illness then, only the carers leave. Definitely sounds like she’s someone who goes from job to job playing the system because she knows there isn’t really anything they can do about it.
That definitely sounds like it in that case. Like you said it’s a tough situation that as an employer you have to tread very carefully around. One thing in my head is that she may be suffering from a mental health issue which can at times mean you need to take long periods of time off for and just telling the people around her ‘oh I had a stomach bug, then I had the flu’ etc because it’s of course an awkward thing to bring up. The certificate itself doesn’t/shouldn’t give a reason on it just say ‘xxxx is not fit for work’ and you also technically don’t need to give your employer a reason.
But the huge batch of carer’s leave at a past job pretty much throws that theory out the window. Just sounds like someone that has thrown in the towel and decided to minimise their workload. The thing is in certain white collar professions especially as you move up the ladder, that sort of thing might bite you (even though it probably formally can’t, if someone has had a bad experience working with you in the past they can just not re-hire you elsewhere) but in a job like nursing because they’re desperate for workers it might not affect her career that much anyway, so she will just keep doing it.
I’m assuming that there’s no 3 month grace period in the UK where the employer can terminate a new employee without a reason?
Not being a smart arse, but - to what end?
She surely wouldn’t have any leave accrued, so she’d be taking it all unpaid?
My experience is that people more often are dealing with some extremely unfortunate circumstance at home (domestic violence/ mental illness/ etc etc) than enacting calculated schemes to take weeks of unpaid leave.
I’ve had a staff member constantly late and or sick.
I know why. And as much I have sympathy for them, they had zero sympathy for me having to do their work and mine. Less said about the business the better …
Your actions have impacts and work still has to be done because of the glorious society we’ve built for ourselves.
At a small business with only a few people, sure.
Big org like a hospital should be able to cover these things with proper roster management imo.
I’m not saying this person necessary has a bright future in this role, but if a nurse we all know is taking extended leave and others are just left to pick up the slack, id be blaming management, more than the worker.
I agree to an extent (especially when management are penny pinching) but if the system were to function well should that person be in attendance, it’s more so on them. A touch falls on management for making the hire to begin with (whole other discussion here around interviewing well vs being actually good at your job exists here too…).
Unplanned absences from time to time are expected where everyone rallies around each other to get shit done - but having a constant anchor attached because they have zero work ethic attached is very much on the individual.
Systems that only work until there’s minor adversity are not systems at all. You can expect better from management - it’s their whole job.
If you have a team of 10 people and 10% are constantly calling in sick on short notice the system will always struggle. Workplaces are generally set so that you can cover a short sick period or at least, plan for an extended leave for individuals. I would suggest what is hitting the team hardest, is finding out last second that someone needs to come in on their day off, cancel plans because they need to stay back late, or cover extra patients because they’re down one person. It’s more about the mental frustration in these sorts of situations with not being able to plan ahead.
Minor adversity is not 9/56 shifts completed…
Not for the worker, but it should be for the organisation
Yeah but you’re talking about one team in a ridiculously complex environment. While i’m not fully aware of all the administrative requirements of hospitals and nursing staff, the organisation isn’t dealing with one person who’s constantly sick. They’re dealing with multiple people in different teams who are also sick, on leave, shifting around for emergencies, while also working within the constraints of availability, experience, and qualifications. I would assume that, if this individual was working as an ICU nurse, you can’t just call up and shift any nurse over to work in the same area, the choices would be fairly limited. Even if you do manage to shift someone from an external team, the pressure is still there on the replacement as well as the other team, to get everyone up to speed.
The point still stands, having a position filled by someone that’s only been there 9/56 times is bad for the team. I can understand someone may be going through some shit 100% but that’s the sort of stuff that needs to be communicated with internally, at the very least to save their jobs. Granted it may not be comfortable, but I dare say most decent managers would accept a conversation starter of: “Hey, FYI i’m going through some massive shit at the moment, I promise once I’m through it, i’m fully back in action.”
For an alternative point of view, if the individual is gaming the system, they’re filling a legitimate position and preventing someone else who actually needs the money and the work from taking on the role.
Yeah the problem comes from them taking up a qualified position. You can’t hire anyone extra and have to find cover from staff doing overtime, casual or agencies.
That all costs the system more so in effect they are taking extra money from the NHS just so they can stuff around.